*Update* Thursday-8/9/07
They've got a guestbook going over at DealsGap.com for visitors to log where they stayed while here. There is a belief that maybe TN politicians don't appreciate how many people come to their state to enjoy this road...that most just spend their time/money in NC. Please take a moment to fill out the form if you have visited the area, so we can share the statistics with those who are behind all this.
*Update* Tuesday-8/7/07
Also, I'd encourage anyone coming to the area, especially within the next few weeks, to carry some form of recording device. Whether it be a simple voice recorder you can pick up at Wal-Mart for $20, or a camcorder. Mount it covertly and record any encounters you have with the LEOs. We've gotten some great submissions already from last weekend that we are putting together to present to the media, but we can always use more!
*Update* Monday-8/6/07
Oh my goodness! I drove through that there "Tail of the Dragon" today and there was not one single Law Enforcement Officer on the entire 9 miles of TOTAL CHAOS AND LAWLESSNESS. There were biker gangs running around like crazed maniacs! I saw almost a dozen bikes on my way across, and they were all screaming by at thirty five, maybe even FORTY miles per hour. The nerve! Those poor people in SUVs and work trucks were being forced back into a single lane of travel...they couldn't even use the whole road! Those bikers are such hooligans...and you could tell it by the way their license plates were mounted too! I'm calling the cops right now...
Seriously, when did enjoying a road become a bad thing?
*Bulletin*
TNHP is conducting saturation enforcement every weekend on the 9 mile section of Hwy 129 for the rest of this month. Utilizing at least 10 patrol cars and/or bikes a day, and scrutinizing anyone and anything that legally drives by them. They will even pull you over without just cause, and inspect your vehicle then release you back onto the roadway for the next LEO around the corner to do it all over again.
Hey we've never had a problem with a bit of sensible supervision...hell it's a welcome sight to see a couple of LEOs "making a presence" on busier days, just to keep everyone sane, but these numbers and attitudes are going too far.
If you value your freedom to ride or drive where you want to in this country without harassment, I urge everyone to SPEAK UP! If you EVER plan to visit Deals Gap, SPEAK UP! Get on the forums, rally the troops, and don't let them walk over us like this. And if you think none of this applies to you, because you are in a different "group", think again. Next time, they could target your group.
This treatment is NOT justified, as there had been no major incidents or accidents prior to their arrival, but since then we have had the worst triple fatality incident in the history of the Gap, with 3 deaths within 24 hours, the worst big rig accident in recent history, closing the road for 2 days and costing over $100,000 to clean up, and the most damage to the road I have ever seen, as a result of the big rig accident. This whole operation has been a fiasco from the very beginning, and done nothing positive for the enthusiasts of the area, the local businesses, or the image of the state of Tennessee.
For now, if you want to ride or drive and enjoy the roads, stick to North Carolina. If you want to be treated like a criminal, visit TN.
Share your encounters with the law by leaving comments here, or on Tail of the Dragon.com, and if anyone has any video or audio evidence of harassment, send it our way as well. We'll present it all to the politician that initiated all of this, TN Governer Phil Bredesen.
A few things you can do to minimize your chances of getting ticketed:
Slow down...especially on your first run through. That's just a good practice anyway to avoid running up on any road hazards or accidents, but especially now that the area is being heavily patrolled.
Make sure the license plate is mounted at the back of the bike, straight and level.
Use a higher gear! I know your R6 sounds wicked awesome at 17,000 rpm, but right now is not the time. They can hear you coming from 2 miles out, and it gets some of those guys riled up...even though you're in first gear going 25mph.
Even these things will not guarantee you won't get pulled over. Plan to be stopped if you come to the area mid-day for the month of August.
(A suggestion submitted by Craig Litz)
All photos are available in 
70 comments:
Does Anyone know the law on tag placement?I looked on line at Tenn. state laws but found nothing.My tag is under the seat with a light shineing on it,but I don't want no trouble.
Imfo would be appericated.
Thanks.
Gov. Bredesen, interesting how you pick and choose what laws you'd like to see enforced, gotta get us darn "bikers" but to hell with any kind of policy on the illegals (sorry i mean undocumented workers) that are mowing down those motorcyclists while half drunk barreling down freeways they can't read the signs along the side of!! The list of better ways to spend that trooper overtime throughout this state is staggering, come on man get real, where's the priorities at?
He's just sitting there so he can be first in line for the release of the Killboy.com t-shirts.
...and I like that Char-Broil ad over there------>. What a bargain!
That stinks about the tag stuff - I bought my bike with a CW fender elim already on it, so my plate is not at the end of my tail anymore. I don't even have those mounts any longer.
I spoke with the assistant director of the Great smokey Mountain National Park in Gatlinburg this month, and he showed me the new map proving that trooper is outside his jurisdiction on that portion of the Dragon. GSMNP boundary runs right down the centerline of 129, from the state line for several miles. So that trooper and Blount County General Sessions Court has no jurisdiction on that portion of the Dragon, especially on the northbound lane. This year ALCOA Corporation donated 11,000 acres on the Dragon to Nature Conservancy Corporation, who donated it to US Forest Service for GSMNP, so the map is all new. TN state rep Doug Overbey is a lawyer in Maryville, who told me the state of TN has no jurisdiction on the Dragon to control traffic, such as banning commercial vehicles, like US Forest Service has already banned on Foothills Parkway and US 441 in GSMNP. These are powerful arguments to use in traffic court to deny the court subject matter jurisdiction. And another trooper was suspended without pay for corruption this week in the Knoxville/Loudon district...
This is a statewide SURGE against the citizens, by THP, sheriffs and local police. WBIR TV bragged that 350 KPD cops wrote over 550 traffic tickets to celebrate Independence Day on July 4th. But this is not anything special, that's how many tickets KPD sues every day, 365 days a year, counting 75,000 annual parking tickets and 75,000 annual robocop tickets (which fired 50 KPD cops and exports $1-million/year to Australia). KPD sues over 200,000 annual tickets against the 160,000 residents of Knoxville. Maybe we can incorporate the Dragon under TN's "Tiny Town" laws, and assign a police chief to enforce all traffic laws on the coppers?
well i'm glad they are there..with all the dead lane crosser and idiots on the dragon i don't even ride it anymore......it is just not safe..i would rather ride downtown knoxville in rushour.. and it is a shame because i love the place,but you just never know who might be in you lane in the next corner anymore.
A little late on this post, but my friend and I were both stopped on July 5th. Got me for tag being under my seat (fresh off the track that Monday & didn't put it back on) and got Brian for his tag being mounted on the swingarm with screws. Said it was dangerous, if the screws came out it could get into the chain or wheel. Was going to get us for Wreckless Driving because we were dragging our knees, but we were only doing about 40-45, so after some arguement, he finally said our bodies were over the line (but I don't think they were) so we got crossing yellow instead of Wreckless. Trying to figure out how much $ fine will be, but BCPD computers are down & can't can even tell us how much they will be.
I can see how the license plate under the tale is a real safety issue? It time to use the above link to the governor and express your point of view.
In response to the trooper being out of jurisdiction...Unfortunately, TN state troopers have jurisdiction throughout the entire dragon...all the way down to the store as an agreement between TN and NC. Remeber guys, even though they are there passing out tickets...they are also there when we wreck and need help. Don't get me wrong...I wish the dragon was less monitored, but I know they are up there because they are told/assigned to. I have spoke to most of them and they would rather be out on the highways then sitting between an 11 mile stretch on road.
so what does this mean for the area now that there will be a steady supply of cops for the area for the next few months. I have canceled my plans to come to the area based on what I have read lately. There are plenty of other places to ride without a cop waiting to write a ticket, for a minor infraction. I can not imagine an on duty cop coming back to the barracks with out something in his ticket book.
How much has this effected the number of riders for the area, after reading Bens blog at the resort the place sounds dead, it also sounds like a great time to go some place else
Bob
EmpireGP.com
Time to re-think your plans, Bob. It'll probably be a safer time to go than in a long time. Just have your bike reasonably legal-looking, stay in your lane, and take advantage of the early morning and late afternoon/evening hours to let it hang out a bit.
Knoxville lawyer Chris Oldham is recommended for bikers by TailOfTheDragon.com. His office in the Walnut Building downtown, next door to lawyer Richard Baker. This phone number is for Baker's office, Oldham's former partner. Just ask for Oldham's new phone number, which is not yet listed in phone books.
http://www.tailofthedragon.com/news_law.html
I spoke with Oldham today about his recent victory in Blount County courts, for Dragonslayers charged with "drag racing". I asked him how he won those trials.
Tennessee Code §55-10-501. Part definitions
(1) "Drag racing" means:
(A) That use of any motor vehicle for the purpose of ascertaining the maximum speed obtainable by the vehicle;
(B) The use of any motor vehicle for the purpose of ascertaining the highest obtainable speed of the vehicle within a certain distance or within a certain time limit;
(C) The use of any one (1) or more motor vehicles for the purpose of comparing the relative speeds of such vehicle or vehicles, or for comparing the relative speeds of such vehicle or vehicles within a certain distance or within a certain time limit;
(D) The use of one (1) or more motor vehicles in an attempt to outgain, outdistance or to arrive at a given destination simultaneous with or prior to that of any other motor vehicle; or
(E) The use of any motor vehicle for the purpose of the accepting of, or the carrying out of any challenge, made orally, in writing, or otherwise, made or received with reference to the performance abilities of one (1) or more motor vehicles;
http://www.megalaw.com/tn/tncode.php
Oldham explained that an "Essential Element" of "drag racing" is a prior spoken agreement to "race". This is, of course, impossible for prosecutors to prove. Without this one Essential Element, the charge of "drag racing" must be dismissed. This elelment is required to prove "mens rea", which is "premeditated intent". Statutes to the contrary are Constitutionally "void for vagueness".
Oldham also proved the THP trooper was guilty of perjury and fabrication of evidence. The trooper testified under oath that he RADARed the bikers at 85 mph on the Dragon. This was NOT proven by the police videotape, which is NOT in sync with the RADAR. However, the Blount County deputy testified under oath that the trooper was lying, that the trooper was NOT running RADAR. Thus the trooper simply made up an imaginary RADAR readout. It's virtually impossible to use RADAR on the Dragon, because it's almost impossible to get a RADAR lock. Accuracy is impossible due to trees giving false readings due to "Panning Effect" (the 86 mph tree).
Oldham said he routinely proves police "testilie" on the witness stand in Tennessee courts, and gets judges to ORDER the prosecutors to prosecute those cops for that crime.
THP troopers routinely lie and purjur themselves when suing traffic tickets on the Dragon. A biker tourist on the Dragon got a speeding ticket from a female trooper driving an SUV earlier this year. The trooper refused to let him see the RADAR readout, which indicate there was no RADAR readout, and the speed was imaginary. The US Navy soldier was from out of state, but said if he were located in Tennessee, he would definitely fight that ticket in court.
Oldham was very interested to learn that Tennessee police and state courts do NOT have jurisdiction on the Dragon, thanks to the 11,000-acre land grab by the federal government, in January 2007. This is according Dragon state rep Doug Overbey, attorney at law, and the assistant director of Great Smokey Mountain National Park. The GSMNP boundary runs right down the centerline of the Dragon US 129, starting at the NC state line, and covers both sides of the Dragon in other places. In January 2007, ALCOA Corporation donated 11,000 acres of its Tapaco Wildlife Area to Nature Conservancy Corporation, which donated it to US Park Service. This land grab removed 11,000 acres from state tax revenues for Blount County Municipal Corporation, including property taxes, sales taxes and traffic ticket taxes.
mmmmmmmmm, ok......
Jackasses passing me in my lane. Other jackasses crossing the double yellow and nearly killing me (thank you Mr. Blue Miata - be thankful I didn't see you face to face later). Truckers taking up multi- S-turns all at once. I'm done with that road. And as for the license plate... I'm all for it. But then, gee, I don't run that road at 80 and I don't run from the cops.
@chornbe
Yep, I'm not saying it was the same "Blue" Miata, but I had one do the same thing to me. I just shook my head.
Please don't let your experience with him draw a conclusion of all Miata drivers. Being one too, it particularly rubs me wrong when I see one do that.
I can't say that I'm going to give that particular Miata driver the power to keep me away from the ToTD. But, the new smoking laws might. But that's a completely different gripe.
Gentlemen don't be fooled, you don't have to be speeding, crossing the yellow line, or have your tag placed in the wrong place to get a ticket... Tuesday July 31st 2007 Friends and myself were parked off on one of the gravel areas with jackets, gloves and helmets off waiting on a friend to catch up when a Blount Co. Sheriff (All Black Car with brushguard, I'm sure you've seen it or one like it) pulled up behind us and issued 5 citations. My opinion is they have now been given a motive to mess with everyone that rides. Noted some act a fool and deserve it but gimme a break 2 no mirror tickets, failure to produce insurance, and an expired tag that expired this month... Give me a break! All for what, what were we doing that justified him pulling over to harrass us,
1) There is one best way to visit the Smokies - by boat. I've towed my 24' SeaRay cruiser to Fontana on this road 50 times.
2) When it comes to motorcycling in the beautiful NC mountains, I just feel sorry for y'all confined to the pavement. Dual Sport is the way to go, more off road than on.
Video: Truck Crash Closes Dragon http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sllQ7Us_78s
TDOT says trucker blames biker for $100,000 crash. THP claims Knoxville News Sentinel has a monopoly on the First Amendment to US Constitution on the Dragon.
@Scotty J.
I couldn't agree more about some drivers not representing the majority.
I'm both a rider and a Miata owner, and I am always careful to maintain my lane and respect the bikers out there. When I am assaulting the Dragon with my car I am careful to not get impatient at the bikers that will not move over or that scream around a corner with their heads and shoulders leaned over into my lane. I've seen some dumb bikers endangering me, and I've also had fellow Miatas try to kill me. It's everyone's road. Let's just be mindful of that and try to share it.
If there were more motorcycle related business located on the Tennessee side of the gap generating tax dollars we might see a change. Without the voting public of the state writing in, I’m afraid Governor Bredesen would have no reason to cease the increase of police presents.
That sucks! Bandofriders.net had 20 guys down there this spring, and we were planning a trip in the Fall and Spring time again with at least that many people for a week.
Thank goodness it's not too late to alter my event in three weeks. Totally sucks, but I hope people will be cool if we stick to the NC side of the house. I've sent my email to them. Won't do anything but I feel better now that I have. Thank goodness I can still do a night run without the brown rounds.
On my way down from Ohio, I'll be filling up in Kentucky and buying all my food before I cross over into that state. Wish me luck that my event doesn't get hurt because of this. :(
--
Stephani
We'll be there the weekend of the Women's Sportbike Rally. I will be waiting to hear reports on the conditions before going across the state line on the Dragon, if the presence is thick, we'll stay in NC the whole time (including skipping the ride on the Cherohala), we'll head out toward Murphy and elsewhere just to ride local roads and spend our gas money in NC not Tenn. If there was anyplace else like Deals Gap on the east coast, we'd skip this 4 day adventure and head there, next year we may loko for rides in WV or PA if this continues. Just frustrating.
Been up there only a couple times this summer, most recently for Miata's at the Gap event. It is getting obscene the amount of police presence up there. It's ONE DAMNED ROAD. 11 miles...and the one day I was up there there were supposedly (and i saw the majority of these) 5 marked BCSO cars, 1 Black BCSO car, 2 unmarked, and a couple bikes....for 11 miles of roadway....
It's kinda too bad i live on the TN side....maybe i'll go find some roads in GA, or take Cherohala over to NC...but that makes it an all day drive rather than a couple of hours over a once-very-fun road. TN needs to pull it's head out of an undisclosed location.
just a note about alternative roadsafter riding the dragon last weekend, my buddies and I went down county road 1310. It runs south from us74 just north of the us129 intersection. It was one of the best roads we rode all weekend. We then came back up sr 28 to us74.We had a blast on the gap after 7pm when the Troopers went off duty so don't change plans to ride the dragon just because of a few (alright 9) THP's in the area.
Well, let's see. There are shots of lane crossers and other asshats on killboy EVERY week...multiple deaths every year...and everyone's surprised and put off that the LEO presence has increased so dramatically. I'm a biker and hate that the heat is coming down on everyone, but were ya'll really surprised? I mean it was pretty predictable. And now, Tennessee is a sucky state because they're trying to cut down on that crap?
Get real! Tennessee is a GREAT state! It's all the asshats that come here and think they can drive/ride any way they wish without regard to the safety of the locals that are to blame. I've seen your feeble attempts at policing your own...it ain't working so they brought in the guns. Yeah, let this kind of shit get outta hand where you live...and see what the local LEO's do. Oh my, they're makin you live within the limits of the law...quit your whinin, they do the same thing at places like Sturgis...show the wrong skin, do a burnout, or get caught takin a toke on main street and guess what...yep, ya go to jail. Well, they're just bein assholes aren't they. I predict the Sturgis rally will dry up and blow away because of the loss of tourist dollars. Next year, I'm gonna stop in Iowa and cart all my food and beer in with me. BWAHAHAHAA!!!
Ya know...when we go to Sturgis, we know the rules. If we wanna do what they don't allow in town, we go out to the campgrounds where it is allowed. Noone sits around town and whines 'cause they won't let us do what we want...where we want. You wanna run speed trials...go to the track!
Hey folks,
The last I checked the falaty rate had almost doubled just prior to TNHP and Blount County patrolling. Hmmm, do you think there was not someone's next of kin calling then?
Well, I ride out there and can tell you that the day the trike hit the boat they were roaring up from NC and crashed just inside TN. So if we cannot behave, then we can expect to be punished. I have seen first hand some riders hot dogging, giving the rest of us a bad name.
So what is the solution? Behave and let those that do not know they have ruined it for the rest of us.
To be honest, we who use the public highway do not have any right to it more than anyone else. I would like it to be a toll road so we can pay to play, but I doubt that will happen.
So there you have it, do not cry and whine because Johnny Law is out there. If everyone was nice and quiet, then he would go somewhere else to look for the action.
The days of speed bikes running up everyone else and expectiing to be waved by in a blind curve or cagers squealing tires are over. Heck, even some of touring bike crowd has been getting a little wild.
So everyone play it cool until the heat is off. It is not just there, but everywhere when people just cannot act right and end up getting hurt or hurting others.
I was cited for doing 38 in a 30 on the dragaon this past Friday. Not riding a wheelie or crossing lanes. Just exceeding the limit by 8 mph. (btw, he didn't lock it in on his radar... does this give me any wiggle room in TN?) While the trooper wrote the ticket, he told me a story about how another rider drove past him and, while looking back to see if he was going to be pulled over, ran off the mountain. The trooper said it was really funny. I think that story irritated me more than the ticket. Makes it hard to believe he's worried about safety when he finds incidents like that funny. Until further notice, TN is on my sh*tlist.
Hey bartp, when were you born? Last night? Hey Mister Trooperman...tell 'em 'nuther bedtime story. BWAHAHAHAA!!! Ya just can't buy this kind of entertainment!
In Tennessee an officer does not have to show the radar. Their training states that they have to track you by sight and estimate your speed. The radar is only for confirmation.
Police are not going to hold roadside court as you inspect their equipment. Too many officers have gotten hurt or killed letting their guard down.
As for the 8 over, speeding is speeding according to the judge out where I live.
As for him telling you a story, I doubt either he/she told you that, or it actually happened. If I was the cop, I might find it funny too considering how many people b*tch about the ticket.
Like a friend of mine said when asked why he was not out catching real law breakers, he is doing it one at a time and it was that speeders turn.
Next time, use the throttle better and discourage anyone from being a jerk out there so the cops will get bored and leave.
Perhaps I should clarify the reason for my inquiry. Some states do afford their citizens the right to request to see the radar gun. The courts of some states have also held that the margin of error inherent in the use of radar guns prevents the state from proving beyond a reasonable doubt that a vehicle was speeding less than 10 mph over the limit. I was curious as to whether TN is such a state. Based upon your response, I presume it is not.
The current enforcement at the gap is nothing shy of pure harassment... I'd love to see a civil suite come from this.. You guys need more media coverage...
Anyone condoning this level of enforcement may as well go be e-tagged by their own local LEOs so they can watch you take a leak at home, wipe you a$$ and whatever else it is you do in your sorry life. Probable cause is not the ability to search you for smiling at a cop while you do the speed limit... TN Gov is a joke - how much $$ will the surrounding areas loose when tourism dies down.. So people die out there - yes but they die at home on the road every day who gives a sh!t it's gonna happen one way or the other. The road should not be open to commercial traffic (I almost bit it when a semi came around a turn and I wasn't speeding!!). Yeah I'd love to see this turn into a toll road with Gap rules but doubt that'd happen too. I remember when the gap was fun, the LEOs there weren't pricks (they were actually pretty decent) and I used to spend my $$ in the surrounding areas when I drove up there. I'm def not returning till winter.
To the Sturgis friendly guy - how suck would it be if you're not speeding and they stop and search you anyway - find your pot and whatever else and it's off to jail with you...
Oh, yet some more entertainment. heheeeeee mtncrvr implies that our little ole helpless community is gonna dry up and blow away from all the $$ we'll miss from the mighty...err...whiny Dragon Slayers. BWAHAHAHAA!
Gots nothing to do with Sturgis my dimwitted little entertainer...just an example of policing your own and payin respect...something a lotta riders now days wouldn't know much about. All the complaints I've read here didn't have anything to do with being stopped without cause...just a bunch of whinin 'cause ya got caught. And now ya wanna sue someone...again...wah wah wah.
And publicly insulting the TNHP with childish penis-envy humor...yeah, that'll get ya where ya wanna be. Like I said...police your own...and respect...
Ok points made, let's not turn this into a flame war between folks on the same team.
Yes they are stopping people who are breaking the law, so what can ya say. But they ARE also stopping people who are doing nothing wrong, see video on TOTD for just one example. And the emphasis on silly shit like license plate placement has nothing to do with safety, as they claim.
Oh, and today ANOTHER semi got stuck in the Gap and had to be towed out. Safety?
I agree with Tequila, we need to police our own. That seems to be going on here, except some folks just don't get it.
There is a big HOG rally at the end of the month of Aug. out in Knoxville. Nothing like that group I have ever seen - you got everything from lawyers, Doctors, to low lifes. They all ride about the same. I do not know many that will be up for waving someone around since they will be traveling in packs.
As far as safety, sounds like they need THPs cousin that runs the scales, you know them as commercial motor vehicle enforcement. The only thing is that they too can write up anyone on two or four (or more) wheels.
Why don't we all try keeping our calm. If you come up on someone slow, then slow down and pull off. Wait a while then go on about your business. If you are going slow, do not put yourself at risk by watching your mirrors the WHOLE time. Just pull off when you can safely and let the bear bait go on ahead.
If you want to really bring up the radar thing, do it in court. Most departments are required to check the calibration of the unit by the officer as well as sending the unit in to the manufacturer or equal for a thorough run down.
But do not set on the side of the road debating it. One last thing, do not refuse to sign the ticket - TN has a law that refusal to sign obliges the officer to escort you to jail to wait for the next appearance available in front of the judge. This is because the ticket is not an admission of guilt just a promisse to appear (or pay if you do not want to appear)
Per tailofthedragon:
HASSLED BY THE LEOs ??? EMAIL US THE DETAILS
Some Emails:
-Rider ticketed for standing-up on pegs to stretch.
-Rider harassed and threatened with arrest for not having proof of shatterproof glasses.
-Cars pulled over for 35 ... threatened with arrest .
-Ticket for failing to have proof of insurance.
-Ticket for no mirrors.
-Cruiser pulled over doing 30 mph and asked for all documentation, blinkers/headlight and plate checked. Harrassed for no reason at all.
-Trooper tailgating female motorcyclist who pulled off road she was so nervous. Her son was then tailgated until he had to pull over.
-Trooper with stopped bike saw another bike almost crash when seeing the Trooper ..... Trooper laughed.
-Out of state car ticketed for having temporary tag and no registration in spite of producing bill of sale. Registration had not yet been sent.
-Trooper with car over double yellow on several occasions.
Troopers making u-turns in dangersous curves
I'm not saying the area will dry up - far from it but it still hurts you folks in the pocket..
Also from tailofthedragon:
UPDATE TUESDAY AUGUST 7, 2007: Monday saw the Troopers pull-back, but we expect them to return in spite of the negative publicity the state is receiving. Just to let you know the negatives are running about 50 to 1. From emails sent to us the state of Tennessee has lost more than a million dollars in revenue from people changing their reservations to North Carolina, Kentucky or Virginia. Several major businesses have vowed to cancel all deals with Tennessee amounting to millions more. Thanks for being heard .... now the rest of you speak up.
I have and will continue to follow the general GAP rules set by Kill boys folks in their efforts to keep it safe up there.
I was pulled over Saturday doing 30 in a 30. I was written up for doing 40 in a 30, in a place you couldn't have gotten a radar lock, and they refused to let me see the printout... meaning they probably lied about even having it. On top of it all, the trooper was just plain rude. I am guessing it was because I was in second gear... the only way I can drive my Miata up there at 30 MPH, and they heard it "sound fast".
Of course, I am going to fight it in court just to make them have to pay more to defend it than they get from me. And... I am writing an article for LGF, Townhall, etc, warning about Tennessee's war on tourism. I would suggest everybody do that, and cc it to all the local chambers of commerce.
Darryl,
Im saddened that you've chosen to take a side in all of this. The vast majority of people like myself, come here to enjoy automotive art. It used to be pictures with the occasional good humor. Now its choose sides/bash and look at pictures to see who's done what. You have a very unique website. Politics Im afraid will destroy it. Im not trying to attack you by any means, I wouldn't do that to a fellow Jack owner :)
Hey I feel ya TnCobra, I'm not enjoying this either. Hopefully it will only be for a few weeks, then back to normal.
I just can't sit back and see anyone disrespecting my friends and customers...never have. I've always tried to stand up to those who cause problems, and let anyone know that if you come here and disrespect folks, I don't care who you are, you're not welcome here. It's all about respect for each other, including you! =)
I think most of us understand what your saying from the pictures you take and the snappy one liner that follows. There are a billion crappy blogs out there. But there is only one really great picture blog out there that has stood above the rest for so long and thats your blog, Killboy.com Jack POWER!
Folks, it does not take but a split second for the radar to "lock" on you. If they use LADAR, even less time.
Just take it easy out there already.
I too thought this website was all thumbs up, even to the point of the warning about the increased patrols, but like tncobra, there is a politcal tone going on.
I recall the episode of Superbikes showing the hot dogging, plus there is the Ride like a Pro DVD that shows the two sportbikes overtaking the more experienced riders only to be chased down by the cameraman. Gosh, with stuff out there showing the few jerks that exist, no wonder we are being watched more closely.
With all of the traffic out there, I am curious on what the ratio is for folks getting written up?
Also, surely those that feel injustice can scan their copy and blank out the personal info so we can see exactly what the tickets are being written about.
Also, thank you to whomever marked the hazards on NC 28. That would be a good alternative since THP is not likely to be in NC.
Everyone who recieved a ticket needs to be encouraged to go to court and demand time in front of a judge. The court backlog would be enormous. A lot of time would be spent on "non-shatter proof sunglasses" and the like. You will very soon have judges writing their own angry letters to the governor.
Lemme give you boys 'n girls a little history lesson. I've been on two wheels for nigh on 40 years now, and I've seen quite a bit. I've been to areas where new rally/event start-ups didn't go so smooth. At first, it was a fun time for everyone...
...then it progressed to a little more hell raisin
...then it progressed to a lack of respect for the locals
...then it progressed to a dangerous environment
...then came the crackdown
...and they didn't care who or for what reason...they just wanted to send the message that they weren't gonna tolerate anymore shit. Ya can whine to 'em all ya want that YOU'RE not one of the "bad guys", but I'm afraid it's now in the crackdown stage, and they really don't care at that point because they don't know you from the next 'un. To them, they have a few dozen, few hundred, or a few thousand...whatever the case may be...in the area, things are gettin outta hand, and they gotta do something about it. If ya got some riders puttin on the badass act...then the LEO's are gonna take the same approach...and they're not gonna be very discriminatory about it. If ya gotta bunch of dogs shittin in your backyard...you're gonna run 'em all off...even the ones not droppin terds.
I'm not sayin it's right or wrong. I'm certainly not condoning harrassment by any LEO's. I'm just sayin that's how things normally progress in these situations. I live in the area so I've been watchin things for quite a while...and from what I've seen, the evolution of the Dragon is right on track as described above. If ya got a ticket unjustly, then fight it...but ya go launchin a "war" on the LEO...you're just gonna make it hotter. Find a way to police your own, pay respect, and help out the locals...and this will eventually die down. Cop an attitude, and they'll keep this up indefinitely...'cause they have a lotta locals behind 'em. You think you're gonna post some shit on the internet, and the governor is gonna cave and call off the dogs? Sorry folks...he's got voters callin on him for this action. I'm not one of 'em...but it was easy to see this comin.
For all of you that do mind your manners on the Dragon...next time take a look around ya...you'll be able to spot the ones bringin the heat down on all of ya's. Instead of cussin the cops...thank these idiots for messin up your good thing.
Killboy, if you're really serious with your mission to make things safer up there and be an ambassador for improving relations...exagerrated statements like "Tennessee Declares War on Tourism" don't help any. They've cracked down on your little road...not tourism. In their eyes, the perceived danger of travelin Tennessee roads is hurting tourism. Clever, juvenile statements aren't gonna get ya where ya wanna be. Inaccurate and juvenile statements just serve to reinforce their view, however inaccurate it might be, that you have a very small egocentric view of the situation, are incapable of seein the bigger picture, and therefore not worthy of workin with on the issues.
I looked up the eye protection law in TN for those that want to know before you go:
55-9-304. Windshields — Safety goggles, face shields or glasses. —
Every motorcycle or motor-driven cycle operated upon any highway or public road of this state shall be equipped with a windshield, or, in the alternative, the operator and any passenger on any such motorcycle or motor-driven cycle shall be required to wear safety goggles, face shields, or glasses containing impact resistant lenses.
[Acts 1967, ch. 45, § 4 (T.C.A. (supp.), § 50-946); T.C.A., § 59-936; Acts 1984, ch. 874, § 2.]
I agree with TequilaJohn, and I have only been riding half the time as him.
For those of you that have more interest in the Tennessee Code Annotated, here is a link: http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpext.dll?f=templates&fn=main-h.htm&cp=
After riding the TotD this past weekend for the first. The 30 mph was kind of low when a 4600# car can roll though there at 40 without much trouble BUT they can not count on the driver being responsable enough to know thier limits.
As a start they need to ban Semis w/ trailers, the need to have cops or TDOT people at the last place these things can turn around or be re routed. If they ignore the signs they should be ticketed just like any one else. Just picking on bikes is showing that they are target enforcment.
If John Doe is over teh double yellow in his beater pick up he gets a ticket just the same as Jane Doe on her sport bike FAIR enforcment of the law I think would go a long way to ease the bad feelings, because its not just bikes, it is cars and trucks as well that cause safty issues on the Dragon.
Trust me I would have loved to cut it loose up there ( between track time and auto crossing I have a good handle on my and my cars ability to say in my lane and not endanger any one else )
Problem comes from people that think that have the skills and don't and thier f' up will cost them or someone else thier life.
To be honest I think the only speed detection device that could work up there would be vascar, laser and radar would have problems with all the turns and braking.
I'll be back, but I wont be spending my money in TN.
-Robert
I think everyone needs to understand that we are all aware of some people driving like they should not on the Gap , but what Darryl is trying to say is it not a reason for the State Troopers to harass everyone.Tequilajohn says he is a local so he should be more worried about all the other crimes going on in his area.You can not go into a store without seeing the little local news tabloid they have of all the local crimes.I was interested in moving to the area but it seems that crimes against people are getting higher.If the Governor worried as much about those crimes as he does the Dragon maybe it would be a safer place to live.It is just plain absurd the attention put on an 11 mile stretch of road when other crimes have increased as much as 50 percent in the last year alone.I now if I lived in the area I would not be worried about someone doing 50 in a 30 zone when there is a drunk loose on the highway ready to kill.Read the facts about how DUI's related deaths have increased.Everyone at Killboy goes out of thier way to help with wrecks,road hazards,and what ever comes thier way.I greatly appreciate all they do and consider each one of them friends.It is not Darryl's fault that troopers are stepping over the line , but it is his right to voice his opinion as well as everyone else.I thank him for giving us all a place to vent out some frustration.I drive 3 hours one way just to ride the Dragon about every other weekend.It is not just to ride but to visit with all the great people you can meet and all the new friends I have made in doing so, but who can afford to come when you now you are going to be just plain out harassed.I obeyed every law and was still scared to death while on the road this past weekend.Just not fun at all.I will wait until all has calmed down before I return.It feels like we are hated by all locals at times it is a shame.
Some of you folks aren't listening. I never condoned any harrassment by the LEO's. I never accused killboy of causin this...mebbe a little immaturity...but not the cause. The state of Tennessee isn't concentrating all of its LEO's on the Dragon. The state of Tennesse DOES conduct DUI road blocks. The state of Tennessee DOES conduct radar speed enforcement on roads other than US-129.
I am reading such egocentric views on here that it is difficult for me to imagine anything positive ever coming of all this. I voice an opinion on here, and Mr. saviour equates that to not carin 'bout the other issues in my area. Everything is seen from your own myopic little view with little understanding of the bigger picture. And what's worse...ya don't seem to be interested in expandin your horizons, actin like an adult, and puttin some serious thought into how this can be resolved...just the usual empty threat of not spendin your $$ in Tennessee, insultin the LEO's, bashin the governor, blah blah blah. Ignorance will not get ya where ya wanna be either.
It doesn't matter who "started it"...crotch rockets...sports cars...those crazy mopeds...noone cares anymore. Because of the stage to which this issue has progressed, the gov is not makin that distinction...they just want to "finish it". And Mister saviour...most all states are gonna be concerned about 20-overs. Certainly, if the drunks congregated in a little 11-mile stretch of road...you can bet your ass you would be seeing a concentrated effort in that area. As it is, they are spread all over...and news flash...it's not just in our poor little unenlightened state. It's such a dangerous place...why I'm just downright afraid to step out my front door every mornin. If only they'd pull all the LEO's off the Dragon, we'd all be safe again. BWAHAHAHAA! Oh man, you guys are killin me. Again, this is the view of a very short-sighted, egocentric little mind. Pullin a few officers into one area to temporarily concentrate on a given issue is not an indicator that they have let all other issues go to hell. Really folks, I KNOW some of ya's have to be old enough...experienced enough..to know better than the drivel bein spilled out on this blog.
It's hilarious to read all the "well, they do it too" comments on here. How damn old are you? Ya know, there are others out there workin diligently on real bikers' rights issues...not just the right to break the law 'cause they like a certain road...and all this crap isn't helpin at all. Grow up, put a little mature thought into this, and work towards a mature resolution...you'll be amazed at how well that old cliche works...and what positive impact it can have on the efforts of others.
For all of you that do mind your manners up on the Dragon, you have my utmost apologies for any unfair treatment you receive in our fine state. Alas, you are unfortunately reaping the rewards from the seeds of others.
Anyways, ya'll have fun with it...I don't have a big enough hammer to beat it in any deeper. Cheers!
I never once said I would not come to Tennessee.I love East Tennessee and travel here all the time and stay with friends in Sweetwater regularly,hell I am here more than home.I just think like most people with good sense that the Dragon is not a place to come to until all this had died down a little.I do not care what state it is if they are lined up waiting to give out tickets I am not going to be there.Tequila,if you can not see that the number of troopers and man hours spent on this is overkill then so be it.That is what the majority is expressing and that the plain outright harassment issues is the concern.I said I would not be worried about someone doing 50 in a 30 the key word being "I" not the state or any other state.I will always be a Dragon fanatic.I love the road and all the friends I have made, it is just a way of life now.Just cooling down and waiting patiently..... :)
Keep up all the good work Darryl, you have far more supporters than nay sayers.
Tequilla, you also have good points,but all the whining,crying and little remarks makes some people not see those points.People are just upset over the harassment issues.State Troopers have guidelines to follow they can not do whatever they want.That is the blunt of the concerns.Nobody whining or crying , just a little upset and we all say things we shouldn't in the heat of anger.I am sorry to anyone that I may have offended. Like Darryl said,let's not turn this into a bashing each other issue.I am a rider to the bone,it is what I love and who I am and I know there are alot of you that feel the same and those are the ones I love to meet.See ya on the Gap.
Egocentric little mind.LOL>LOL>LOL>
Did not see that the first time guess my little mind was wondering on other issues.That is hilarious :)
The only egocentric views I see around here is from TequilaJohn.
Here is a lesson for you.
I have read reports of harassment on the Dragon on a few websites and forums now. This made me and my friend who organize a yearly Porsche meet on the Dragon to take this years meet somewhere else. With that goes our money.
When the local business owners feel the pinch from the lack of tourism. They will start to wail.
Speak with your wallets folks, there are TONS of fun roads all over North Carolina, Georgia, south Carolina and Kentucky to go ride on.
Tennessee wants us all to leave their roads alone. Thats fine with me, I had begun exploring many other roads last year just because there were just too many cars / Bikes / Motorhomes / Tractor Trailers on the Dragon lately.
I have a whole bunch of fun roads I ride now and many of them are EMPTY = much more fun for me.
Maybe someday, I'll head back over to the Dragon but for now, and for this years meet, I am taking it elsewhere.
Jim you and the rest that say, "I am taking my money elsewhere" are a joke. Look at all the pretty photos below, does not look anything like a deserted stretch of Highway to me yet. I bet they spent some money. The folks I have met coming from Knoxville and the surrounding areas might get some food and gas and head back, but they are out there more than the once a year groups. In fact, if there are fewer people out there, then the idea that the cops will run out of things to do seems even more feasible if you do not think you can control yourself or keep your friends from getting too much unwanted attention by going. That would be less traffic.
I know not everyone lives in Tennessee, but to let you in on something - every year there is a campaign by ALL LAW ENFORCEMENT called 100 days of summer heat. They run ads on TV and radio explaining that the death rate and crashes statewide has resulted in crackdown on ALL traffic violations. It is a ZERO TOLERANCE thing. It is nothing new has been going on for years and starts when summer begins, it is just the number of deaths and other mishaps has drawn Hwy 129 higher on the list this year. Tequila's right, the cops really do not care who did what to start the trouble, they just want it stopped. How do they know when it is stopped, when there is nothing to do besides watch the parade go by in a calm and courteous fashion.
Tequila is just passing on what years on wheels has taught him. I know that it could get worse out there like having checkpoints set up to do nothing but check registration, license, and proof of insurance. It happens out here when a few folks are acting badly, but we all get checked.
I learned from experience that crack downs are not just on that road. They occur when noise ordinances get passed (from a few who disrespect by rapping pipes or cranking stereos), when curfews are set (from a few who tag/rob/etc), and when no cruising zones are established (from too much traffic interfering with normal happenings). Heck, even in the workplace there are crack downs when folks start getting out of line.
Saviour - THP is doing what THP does (and is supposed to do) - patrol the roads. That is their purpose (hence the name Highway Patrol). It is TBI and local cops that gets into the other crimes and Drug Task Force that hunts the dope supply. I have not seen a shortage out in my part Tennessee of Troopers, I guess they must be hiring more everyday. The Sheriff Department there is doing what the Blount County Citizens want done, not what the out of County folks want. As far as the rest of the crime - I do not know too many robbers who walk off with what they get. Usually they have some means of transportation. Why else would there be a topic for the stolen bike(s)? Is someone going to be pushing them up the road?
As far as out of state folks not wanting to go, I checked with some riders coming out to Tennessee at the end of the month and they still want to ride the dragon. I guess that little extra risk of getting pulled over is a thrill. Heck, I would rather have that than getting run over by someone trying to prove that a 1.5 hour trip from Maryville to Robbinsville can be done in less time.
Finally, the semis on there are a hazard, always have been and will be until THE FEDS change it. So write you senators and congressmen since it is a US Hwy. Point out the alternate routes that are available for trucks that size that may not have been there decades ago when this road was opened.
I have posted the link to a Law source for Tennessee Code. Read it if you want or not. But knowing might keep you out of trouble or help you on court day.
You all have fun and remember be good and if you can't be good then be careful.
And Tequila, Good try on teaching. Look me up.
To the gang of the website, thanks for the photos. I look forward to seeing you all at the end of the month. I will be the one on the black bike. :)
One last thing, like pointed out the statement that Tennessee declares war on tourism does sound inflamatory since Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg are still packing in folks everyday, or is Dolly in on it too?
But then what about all the guys and gals visiting in downtown Nashville, Memphis, Knoxville, and Chattanooga and etc? I guess they do not know yet right?
It sounds like you are saying that North Carolina is a safe harbor for law breakers since no one is going to look.
It sounds nicer and may draw some really good crowds for area to deal with.
R-Rated - You are correct, we really did not spend a lot of money in Tennessee last year, we book out about 30-40 room at Fontana for 3 nights, ate in their restaurant, drank in their bar at night, bought local gas, and ate in local establishments. Some bought souvenirs and while a few were not far from the Dragon (1-2 hours drive) we chose the stay at the lodge for social reasons.
I am sure Pidgeon Forge and Gatlinburg are not affected, but these are places I avoid like the plague. I did not come to the mountains to see 192 in Orlando and that is what those places are.
We also do not see NC as a haven for lawbreakers like you are so dramatically describing us. The speed limit is 55 on most of the back country roads in NC. Its really hard to break the law when the speed limit is 55.
Don't forget SC, Ga, and Ky they all have fun roads too.
While I love tail of the dragon, I checked my list of things I like to do and getting pulled over by a cop ever 1/4 mile for no reason other than to fish for a ticketable offense was not on my list. So yeah, I'll pass on that mess.
BTW - We book in Fontana at a time when they are basically empty and the rest of the local lodges are closed, if you think for a minute that they do not appreciate the business we are bringing there your mistaken.
This affects more than Tennessee, it affects all the businesses along 129 in NC too.
That show them Jim, take your ball and go home. As you pointed out, your money was needed in NC. Last time I checked there are some mighty fine roads over there that make the Dragon seem boring.
But I guess where ever you all decide to congregate should be warned not to count you coming back there either right?
Like I tried to point out, just because there are increased patrols, does not mean that you cannot still enjoy the drive/ride. Of course, that is unless you have an "It's all about me" attitude.
I still plan on going and so does a majority that will be out there at the end of the month. We may not focus our attention to just 11 miles when there is so much else out there to see.
Just checked with the law source I cited above, the TN statewide speed limit is 65 except for Interstates where it is 70 and anywhere where it is otherwise posted.
I also found this little gem
55-8-166. Driving on mountain highways. —
The driver of a motor vehicle traveling on mountain highways shall hold such motor vehicle under control and as near the right-hand edge of the highway as reasonably possible and, upon approaching any curve where the view is obstructed within a distance of two hundred feet (200") along the highway, shall give audible warning with the horn of such motor vehicle.
[Acts 1955, ch. 329, § 66; T.C.A., § 59-867.]
Now there is something that you do not see (err uh hear) everyday.
Let me start by saying that this was brought on by yourselves. Darryl has asked on many occassions for you to upshift so as to not make so much noise. But no one listened. Now that the residents of the area are making noise, you have suddenly opened your ears because now it is hitting closer to home for yuns'. It's not a race track, and the road leading to the dragon damn sure ain't no race track. Show some restraint, show some common since, and most of all, show some RESPECT to the locals who live hear. I was born and raised in this area and have lived hear all my life. There are alot of old families that have been here for many generations and they like the way life used to be around here. I've been riding the dragon for more than 25 years and riding bikes for more than 30 years and it has definitly changed around. I know it will never be like it was, but it should be better than it has been for the last couple of years.
EXAMPLE: Last august I e-mailed Darryl about a church that was fed up with not being able to hear the cermon because of the noise from the cars and bikes screaming by and he posted it on the web site. The first comment posted was "BURNOUT PARTY AT THE CHURCH SUNDAY". I was really dissappointed the following sunday when bike after bike would fly by, pull in the clutch and rev-up there engines when going by the church. So thanks (you know who you are assholes). That type of mentallity is what has ruined it for all of us.
I'm not taking either side but here is where I stand on the issue. When I go ride, I don't go screaming through residential neighborhoods where there are children playing, family pets running around, retired and sick elderly trying to have a peaceful remainder of there lives. I don't let my boys walk to the 72 PIT STOP anymore because of the way people act coming through the area. If someone was to lose it and hurt one of my children, that person would go to the hospitol whether they were hurt in the accident or not. If some was doing 100 MPH through your subdivision and wiped out and hurt one of your children, you would act same the way. So be RESPECTFULL when you come through our neighborhood.
Before all the a$$hats started coming up and riding(and wrecking), the BCSO would sat at tabcat and would not go into the dragon unless there was a accident. We would launch right in front of them and they would do nothing. Sometimes they would sit before the overlook just to watch, the same way we like to watch someone dragg a knee. I have friends with both the THP and BCSO and they used to love to run the dragon with me but anymore it just ain't worth the risk. It got to where we would only ride tue.-thur. but even that isn't safe anymore. Now we only do night runs and even then were seeing more and more traffic.
Sorry for ranting on Darryl, I never post but this is close to home(literly). Don't stop the e-mails because something still needs to be done about the truck traffic.
With that being said I will set back and read the negitive comments that I'm sure will follow.
Be RESPECTFULL, have fun and GOD SPEED.
Well hell...just couldn't leave this one alone.
kg4glk is but one example of the "locals" I have been speakin of...and he makes some very valid points. Be thankful you're only experiencing a crackdown...if the Dragon was not a public highway, your playground would have already been shut down completely with that kinda treatment of the locals.
Also, thought I'd educate Mr. jim a little...as well as anyone else unsure of the definition of the word, egocentric:
egocentric - having little or no regard for interests, beliefs, or attitudes other than one's own; self-centered
This term generally concerns an individual, but may also be applied to a group of individuals concentrating on a single/similar interest or issue. It's not to say that one never thinks of anyone but themselves, but in this case, moreso that some can't see anything but their side of the issue...i.e. an egocentric view. You can never resolve an issue intelligently if you remain blind to all sides but your own.
Quotes from jim:
"I have read reports of harassment on the Dragon on a few websites and forums now."
Mr. jim seems to equate this with fact, when in reality, these "reports" originate from websites most likely with something to gain/lose depending on what happens on the Dragon...or forums populated with individuals with similar interests/issues...i.e. high likelyhood of the info being tainted, or at least slanted in a given direction. This is not to say that all his info gleaned is inaccurate or slanted...but without tempering this data with info from opposing views or neutral positions, one cannot be sure. In other words, stand up and fight the fight along side your contemporaries, but don't believe everything you see and hear JUST because it came from one of your peers. Investigate with critical and deliberate thought.
"Tennessee wants us all to leave their roads alone."
Well now, this is a good 'un. Because the state of Tennessee and local agencies have concentrated some of their efforts on a particular area due to problems arising from said area...and said area being of particular interest to Mr. jim, he equates that with the entire state of Tennesse wanting ALL out-of-staters to go elsewhere. This is the very essence of being egocentric in nature. If I didn't know better, I would estimate this statement came from a 12-year-old...sorta along the lines of "I'll take my football and go home."
Mind you, I'm not trying to pick on jim here...or anyone else...just tryin to educate. These kinds of statements that have no standing in fact, are juvenile at best, and provide fuel for the fire. Do any of you really think anyone of power reading these statements are going to take you seriously? Do you think they would ever invite anyone makin such statements...includin killboy's headline...to sit down and discuss the issues? Do you really think they will respond to your complaints of harassment with anything other than a chuckle after seein/hearin such nonsense?
Some of you are actin as tho the govenor has a personal vendetta against you and/or those with which you prefer to ride. Do you really think this is even close to the top of his priority list? More likely, it's high on one of his lieutenant's lists...because enough people have broached the subject in a more articulate fashion. In other words, his voters have called for this in a fashion that got someone's attention. The juvenile statements and empty threats I've seen on here, and elsewhere, will get you nowhere.
Darryl, I've admired your attempts at makin things safer up on the Dragon. However, how can you ever hope to be any kind of ambassador for better relations and riding environment...not to mention, ensure the future of your business...if you position yourself as part of the problem in the eyes of the powers that be. You have posted childish and inaccurate statements, and basically declared a war you can never win. It may look good to the uninformed...and may get ya some pats on the back from some other chest thumpers at the pullouts...but that's 'bout as far as it'll take you. I'm writing the gov and my reps...not to object to the crackdown, or sling insults...but to request that they monitor their officers to ensure they are only thumpin those that deserve it. And no, I'm not naive enough to believe that will make the difference...but if enough of you approach them in an intelligent and respectful manner...who knows.
I'm only pursuing this thread as far as I have 'cause, like I said, there are others out there right now workin on much more serious issues for bikers...and the childish behaviour and expressions I'm witnessin are going to do nothing but hurt those efforts. I have complained for a while now about the selfish attitudes and lack of respect I see from a lotta so-called bikers these days...and finally figured out that it might just be a lack of "education"...and no, not the academic type. Things have changed greatly from "my days". Back then, if ya needed it, ya got educated without seekin it out...if ya know what I mean. I finally saw that my complaints were empty if I wasn't willin to do my part in continuing the education of those riders in need of such a thing. Ya'll take care...and give this stuff some thought...it'll only help ya in the future.
r-rated, checked out your site...looks like you're 'bout 400 miles roundtrip...would make a good dayride...might drop in on ya one day.
I will be in town tonight and maybe I will drive up there Saturday to see for myself.
I have grown to trust what Daryll has to say on here and while he has a vested interest in the Dragon, he, like a lot of us are also enthusiasts who enjoy a fun ride on the road. He also has been an advocate of safe driving and has called out morons on the road.
kg4glk - I remember your post, and I have always motored over to the Dragons Tail as slowly and quietly as possible respecting all the homes and churches along the way there. I wouldn't throttle the car until I was past Hellbender and away from businesses and residences.
I can still remember my first pass on the Dragon, I was nervous and I was afraid I would hold others up, or get in over my head. I can safely say I never never pushed past 60% of my or my cars ability on there.
I do not go there to set a speed record, I used to go there to enjoy some nice twisty challenging roads without a worry about cars turning onto it off of side roads.
The last year especially has seen The Dragon get almost too busy. Hence our decision to hold an event there with our cars in the Winter when most of the tourists are gone and we get the road to ourselves.
To be fair, I'll go out and take a look for myself and decide if its worth even being there.
Thank you Jim for at least opening up to see for yourself before swearing off the area.
Thank you Tequila for sharing with everyone. Come on out - it is a day ride all right, but it can be enjoyable if done correctly. I can take you on some nice roads out here too so maybe a cultural exchange program can be started via riders. Here the locals do not use you'uns its y'all. I noticed that when I was in Greeneville/Morristown one summer a few years back. I am a desert rat myself from Phoenix.
Finally, thank you kg4glk for showing what happens for the locals (EVERY DAY). According to the email I got back from Tail of the Dragon, no locals connect with that road. Check out www.v-twinforum.com for that series of correspondence (I will update my website with it as well, just do a search for me online, or email me if you want to). So your posting does help everyone realize how they effect everyone else.
The Tennessee Highway Patrol (THP) is responsible for the enforcement of all federal and state laws relating to traffic. Serving the entire state of Tennessee with substations in each of its 95 counties, the THP has district headquarters in eight locations as well as scale houses in 5 additional locations. The Tennessee Highway Patrol is responsible for investigating accidents involving property damage, personal injury, and fatalities. When personal injury or fatal accidents involve drugs or alcohol, the THP is responsible for prosecution in the courts and working with the Attorney General's Office.
The Highway Patrol is active in criminal interdiction, which involves the suppression of narcotics on the roads, highways, and interstate systems in Tennessee. The Edward Byrne Memorial Grant Program provided $127,000 for operation "No Drugs," funding overtime for criminal interdiction enforcement. Additionally, the Tennessee Highway Patrol maintains a riot squad in each district that can respond to any emergency that may arise.
r-rated--this is The Mission Statement from the Tennessee Highway Patrol site.The DUI's was the problem I was laying in thier laps.I also noticed that out of 453,000 and some odd citations there was only 4053 DUI's.This is just an issue close to home to me for personal reasons.My other statement was that the Governor should be more worried about the serious crimes as he is the Dragon.
I whole-hearted agree with the statements of the locals of the behaviour of some bikers on the other local roads.I remember when Darryl posted the warning about the church protests.I drive in on HWY 72 from HWY411 and even though my K1200LT does not make much noise, I still slowed down and even went as far to turn off the radio when passing the churches since it was a Sunday morning.
I also cringed at the site of a group of bikers racing up and down HWY72 about 2 weeks later.The whole gang was there doing tricks and drag racing.I thought then that this would bring in the patrols.I am fully sympathetic with the locals on this subject.Darryl has been real blunt and to the fact in his warnings but lets face it not everybody that rides the Gap reads the sites or even care about the locals.
I think that is where I should have taken the time just to stop and inform them of the situation.Some would listen and I know others would not,but at least I could have tried.
The fact is still the same.The troopers can do thier job without the harassment.Period.
"There are cities that don't want large groups of bikers spending money patronizing local businesses. The police showed up and threatened to arrest everybody and confiscate their bikes. I'm at a loss for words. They've got a helocopter and 15 cop cars. They thought everyone would scatter like roaches. Police are over it. Time to move on the greener pastures. In our 3rd stop the police asked us to leave immediately. It's like They hate me when I show up."
-Jason Britton, host of Superbikes -- West Coast Presidents Alliance, Speed TV, 8 August 2007
The intro to each episode of Superbikes TV begins with a map of the Tail of the Dragon at Deals Gap, and Jason draggin a knee on 129...
Hey Jim, we DO appreciate your respectful approach to our community. I hope you
are not unjustly hassled on your visit.
As for Mr. pirate...and just so the rest of ya's know...here's a quote from his
entry in the Deals Gap guest book.
"We shall punish the evildoers. That means you, guvnah."
Again, while this may get ya some pats on the back at the pullouts, and some woo
hoos from the equally unenlightened...it's an incredibly juvenile and
irresponsible expression, and will only hurt your cause. Threatentin the
governer...yeah, that'll REALLY get ya where ya wanna be in any state! I know some
of you are young...but I also know that if you're capable of learnin the technical
skills required to handle those powerful bikes you ride...then you're also capable
of learnin how to handle this situation in a better, more constructive manner. If
all ya wanna do is impress some of your peers and make the situation worse...then
by all means, follow Mr. pirate's example...but I'm pretty sure that's not what ya
want.
Instead of gettin on here, and other sites, and postin childish and derogatory
comments, put that time and effort into writing to the appropriate officials. Take
a firm stance on the matter, but be respectful in your letter...and never include
any threatening comments. Even it it is your intent...don't threaten to "never
visit Tennessee again"..."never spend money in Tennessee again"...etc. To them,
these are very empty threats, and just indicates you are not willin to deal
responsibly with the issue. They are doin what they are doin because a buncha
people have already communicated to them that they want this action. The only way
to combat it is to do the same, but in an intelligent, respectful, and
constructive manner.
The citizens of Tennessee are indeed VERY friendly and neighborly...and we do
appreciate your visits and the $$ you spend in our state. But, without any insult
intended, the $$ spent in this state by visitors whose only, or primary,
destination is the Dragon, is like findin a quarter in the sofa compared to all
the other tourism across the state...or even just in East Tennessee. You will not
be able to use that alone to leverage your way outta this situation...and
certainly not if it is used in antagonistic and insulting fashions. You have to
remember that these officials are considering the entire state...not just that one
stretch of road. I just read some statements from the Tennessee Commissioner of
Tourism that they have been receiving quite a few letters and emails expressin
concern for their safety while visiting the area. They have also received reports
from area busniesses that some have cancelled, or are considering cancelling their
visits to our state. The inquiries these businesses are receiving indicate that a
good many folks are concerned for their safety. If any of these folks hit this
site, or some others, and see the attitudes bein expressed here...it will just
confirm their fears. It doesn't matter if you feel their fears are justified or
not...if Tennesse's officials feel they have to shut down your fun to ensure all
other tourists do not see Tennessee as a dangerous place to visit, or to ensure
the safety of the locals...they will do just that.
For those of you that are serious about doing something constructive on this
issue, here is a link to some tips on writing elected officials.
http://www.fastfreds.com/articles/writingeffectiveletters20070217.htm
The Nature Conservancy Corp of Blount County grabbed 10,000 acres of Dragon in 2007. Nature Conservancy is run by ex TN state senator Bill Calbough, who passed the TN law naming Pellissippi Parkway I-175 in honor of the convicted hit-and-run murderer of a biker Dragonslayer. Is this land being grabbed for private development, just like Nature Conservancy and Clabough grabbed 5,000 acres on Chilhowee Mountain for private develpment?
http://www.smokymountainriders.com/viewtopic.php?p=6104#6104
This appears to be ETHNIC CLEANSING on the Dragon, to eliminate tourists, businesses and property owners, prior to Lamar Alexander buying 10,000 acres on the Dragon, like he just bought 5,000 acres elsewhere in Blount County?
ATTENTION PHOTOGRAPHERS ON THE DRAGON WINNING TICKETS FOR "NON-COMMERCIAL VEHICLE TAGS"
I called the Knox County clerk's office today, regarding "commercial vehicle registration" (vehicle license tags). The clerk parroted the THP claim that any person driving a car while "working" as an employee or business owner must buy a special "commercial license tag" that has an "H-1" prefix.
When I asked what was the TN Code for that law, the clerk said she had no idea, but would transfer me to another office to the supervisor. No answer at the supervisor's office at 11 am, and no returned call yet.
WHEN I LOOKED IT UP FOR MYSELF, THERE IS NO LAW IN TN CODE REQUIRING COMMERCIAL LICENSE PLATES ON PRIVATE OR BUSINESS VEHICLES THAT ARE NOT TAXI CABS CARRYING PASSENGERS "FOR HIRE".
THIS CURRENT THP SCAM ON THE DRAGON TARGETING PHOTOJOURNALISTS IS A DE FACTO (ILLEGAL") WHEEL TAX PERPED BY CROOKED COUNTY CLERKS.
TN Code 55-4-112. Registration fees for private and commercial motor vehicles operating for hire and transporting passengers — Fees deemed additional to certain registration fees
http://www.tennesseeanytime.org/laws/laws.html
(a) The registration fees for private and commercial motor vehicles operating for hire who transport passengers shall be as follows:
Click to view form.
(b) Where any route over which such vehicle is operated is exclusively within the limits of a municipality of the state, or where such route is partially within and partially without the limits of a municipality of the state, but does not extend more than fifteen (15) miles beyond such municipal limits, or where such route is wholly within the limits of a metropolitan government created under title 7, chapter 1, the fees shall be in addition to the registration fees set out in § 55-4-111 for passenger motor vehicles, fifty-five cents (55") for each passenger seat, with a minimum fee of twenty-seven dollars and fifty cents ($27.50) for any single vehicle. The applicant must submit an affidavit confirming the route mileage and seating capacity of any vehicle registering under this provision.
TN Code 55-4-112 Amendment
http://www.state.tn.us/sos/acts/102/pub/pc0856.pdf
Note the text grammar of this statute, to understand the ESSENTIAL ELEMENTS of this "crime".
Quote:
1. A private vehicle (car or minivan) or "commercial vehicle" (truck or bus)
AND
2. FOR HIRE (taxi service)
AND
3. CARRYING PAYING PASSENGERS (taxi service)
OR is not the same word as AND. This means ALL THREE Essential Elements are required.
This law ONLY applies to taxi cabs for hire.
DON'T PAY THESE TICKETS OR BUY NEW TAGS! LOOK IT UP FOR YOURSELF OR TALK TO AN HONEST LAWYER. THE GOVT HAS TO PAY YOUR ATTORNEY FEES WHEN YOU WIN, PER THE HYDE AMENDMENT
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/memoranda/m01-01.html
http://www.smokymountainriders.com/viewtopic.php?t=543
THIS IS JUST ANOTHER SCAM BY THP AND GANGSTA GOVT?
Oh Lordy, non-riders and weekend lawyers. This is truly scary.
Normally I wouldn’t comment on posts but I felt that I had to as your writing style is really good. You have broken down a difficult area so that it easy to understand.
http://www.colonialmed.com/
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